Saramago e D-us - Anselmo Borges | ASIA MUSIK

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Passado o rebuliço mediático, quereria escrever sobre o tema em epígrafe. Só sobre ele. Deixo, pois, as questões literárias, partidárias, políticas, incluindo a nódoa indelével daquele desgraçado despedimento de 22 jornalistas do DN por delito de opinião. Exijo-me este texto, até porque, numa entrevista a João Céu e Silva, Saramago se me referiu com admiração por ter lido e gostado do seu livro Caim: "Até fiquei surpreendido quando ouvi um teólogo - uma coisa é um teólogo e outra um padre -, Anselmo Borges, dizer que tinha gostado do livro".

Quem, no meu entender, melhor escreveu sobre o tema foi Eduardo Lourenço. Entre outras coisas, porque introduziu o pensar sobre o ateísmo até ao limite. "O que designamos por 'ateísmo', na sua literal acepção, significa, geralmente, mais do que o seu conteúdo dialecticamente negativo. Denota um relacionamento de grau nulo com o referente Deus. É tão impensável ou inacessível na sua ordem como a pura transcendência, que é conteúdo real ou imaginário de Deus. Ser ateu é só ser e estar 'sem Deus'. Perspectiva tão vertiginosa como a que a referência a Deus assinala, sob o modo de uma 'ausência' tão impensável como a de Deus e não menos 'abscôndita', só que mais dolorosa, que a da presença das presenças."

Segundo a tradição e na modernidade, "considerou-se ateu e deve assim ser considerado o sujeito para quem 'o nome' e, sob ele, a mesma ideia de Deus - não o conceito - não tem sentido algum." Mas não haveria mais motivo para designar como "ateu" quem "tivesse a pretensão de o objectivar, ou de conceber claramente, o que ele mesmo chama Deus"? Afinal, verdadeiramente ateus não seriam precisamente "os chamados teólogos, pelo menos os clássicos - anteriores a Karl Barth -, que sabiam tudo de Deus, ou que sabem tudo de Deus"?

Exceptuando os místicos, é raríssimo o crente que se apercebe de que perante Deus só o silêncio é que diz, pois, no limite, Deus é nada do que dele o linguajar humano possa dizer. Ouvi uma vez a Jacques Lacan: "os teólogos não crêem em Deus, porque falam dele". E também Karl Barth, o maior teólogo protestante do século XX, disse que conhecia muito bem um certo ateu: justamente Karl Barth.

Há dois modos de negação de Deus: a negação real e a negação determinada.

Por negação determinada, entende-se a negação de um determinado Deus, de uma certa imagem de Deus. Foi o que Saramago fez. Como podia ele ou alguém intelectualmente honesto aceitar um deus cruel e sanguinário?

No Caim, é essa imagem do deus violento e arbitrário que denuncia. Não é de facto a Bíblia judaica, no dizer do exegeta católico Norbert Lohfink, "um dos livros mais cheios de sangue da literatura mundial"? De qualquer modo, o nome de Deus foi demasiadas vezes invocado para legitimar a violência e o derramamento de sangue de inocentes.

É certo que no Novo Testamento, na única tentativa de "definir" Deus, se diz que "Deus é amor incondicional". Mas também há acenos para uma interpretação sacrificial da morte de Cristo, teorizada sobretudo por santo Anselmo e desde então muito pregada: Deus precisou da morte do seu próprio Filho, para reparar a ofensa infinita cometida pelos homens e assim reconciliar-se com a humanidade. Ora, precisamente perante esta concepção sacrificial da sua morte como preço do resgate do pecado, como não entender a inversão da oração de Cristo na Cruz? Onde, no Evangelho, se diz: "Pai, perdoa-lhes, porque não sabem o que fazem", lê-se, em Saramago: "Homens, perdoai-lhe, porque ele não sabe o que fez".

A negação determinada não significa negação real. A pergunta é, portanto, se Saramago negou realmente Deus ou se, pelo contrário, na negação do deus arbitrário e sanguinário, não está dialecticamente presente o clamor pelo único Deus verdadeiro, o do Anti-mal. De qualquer modo, segundo Saramago, "Deus é o silêncio do universo, e o ser humano o grito que dá sentido a esse silêncio". "Esta definição de Saramago é a mais bela que alguma vez li ou ouvi", escreveu o teólogo Juan José Tamayo [e acrescento para ilustrar: http://www.altonabbey.org.uk/].

http://dn.sapo.pt/inicio/opiniao/interior.aspx?content_id=1692997&seccao=Anselmo


Interview with Dr. John C. Kim


EN: When did you become a Christian?

Dr. Kim: I became a Christian when I was in my first year of high school. A pastor, Pastor Choi, came to plant a church on a hill near the village where my family lived. I lived very far from a big town or city in Korea. This pastor actually married my cousin. So my family didn’t have any choice but to go to that church. That same year, during summer vacation, Pastor Choi, actually put me on an administrative team for a summer vacation school for kids. He would tell the kids about Abraham, Joseph and Daniel—great men of faith. Obviously, the person he emphasized most was Jesus Christ. I was so intrigued. That summer, I became a Christian because of his simple illustrations of great men and women in the Scripture. I had received Jesus Christ as my Savior and Lord, no doubt about it, but the real transformation took place way, way later.



EN: You didn’t have any knowledge of the Bible before?

Dr. Kim: I had no idea about the Bible before going to this church because I grew up in Korea while it was under the Japanese colonial rule. The colonial rule ended in 1945, when I was in elementary school. Then the Korean War broke out, which led to the devastation and ashes of a divided country of war. After all of this, many people were looking for an answer—the meaning to all of this.



EN: Why did you decide to come to America?

Dr. Kim: The very purpose why I came to America was because of my studies. I came specifically to study American government and its policies. In 1965, I was invited by Up With People, a moral movement in America and all over the world. This organization invited me and eight of my friends, who were young adult leaders in college. Through this program we traveled for two months, probably visiting more than 27 states and historical sites. When I went back to Korea, my wife and I were dating seriously and we got married upon the premise that we would come to America. We married on March 11, 1967. After living in Korea for three months, my wife and I left for Japan. With three pieces of luggage and $200, my wife and I crossed the Pacific Ocean and landed in Los Angeles. I was poor but we also weren’t allowed by the [Korean] government to take more than $100 per person. Everything was up in the air. Although Jesus was not the center of my life, we did have faith. My wife especially had faith that one way or another, the good Lord would lead us. After staying in Japan for about six months, we left for America for my Masters at the University of Southern California (USC). I was the first person from a non-English speaking country to study Public Policy for my Masters.



EN: Why did you want to study American Government?

Dr. Kim: I wanted to know why America was so powerful. I wanted to investigate and research and examine the reason for its success. When I left Korea in 1967, Korea was very poor. It was under a military dictatorship. It was still in a very shaky situation. When I was a university student, Korea’s per capita GDP was only $87. That was life. I wanted to see how such a small country like Korea, especially a divided country, who depended so much on the U.S.A., would be able to survive with the help of America.



EN: Was it hard adjusting to life in America?

Dr. Kim: During that time discrimination was prevalent in America. A year after we arrived, Martin Luther King was assassinated. There were hippies and yuppies and the Vietnam War. You could see these young people on Sunset Boulevard—these hippies. Nobody paid attention to me and my wife. There weren’t very many Koreans in LA. There were only three churches and one restaurant. No grocery store. We felt misplaced.



EN: Was it difficult studying in America?

Dr. Kim: It was such a difficult, hard nightmare. Professors laughed at me because they said that no one had ever studied and earned a degree in American policy from a country like Korea. But I’m a very persistent person. I didn’t give up. I had to go to class and it was predominately white. I was the only one in the class with a language problem. Believe me, it was the most frustrating and yet incredible challenge that I had to go through. One time, I didn’t get up from my chair for 78 hours—that’s a record. I was constantly studying. I probably slept for four hours a day for five years.



EN: Did anyone encourage you?

Dr. Kim: I did meet a professor, Dr. Lammers, who was a Christian. He really had the compassion of Christ. And he pushed me to the edge and poured into me—academically. I would meet him every Friday morning for two hours. One time I went to see him and he gave me a list of 48 books. He said, “I want you to read them all.” I almost quit. Fortunately, I was able to read well but it was the most grueling, grueling assignment that I’ve ever done. I lived in Glendale, CA and I would work in a hospital on the weekends and I changed the bus twice so that one day I barely made it by 8:00 a.m. I hadn’t read anything and Dr. Lammers said, “Well, you have the entire night.” He tested me to the greatest extent–beyond the horizon. He wanted to know how far I could go. He died two years ago and I cried and cried because He was the best professor that I ever had.



EN: You did achieve your goal by receiving a Ph.D. and got your first full-time teaching position at Pepperdine. But soon after, you discovered that you had a terminal liver problem, can you talk a little about that?

Dr. Kim: In 1976 I was given the Teacher of the Year award. There’s no way that I could be that good. It was because of the grace of God. I had done my dissertation on one of the most important topics at the time so I was invited to many conferences. I had also become a deacon of my church but I was growing further from God. I became so arrogant and proud rather than giving all the praise to God. I felt like I finally made it and to celebrate, my family went on a trip. We had a great time. That year, when I came back to teach at Pepperdine, I felt really sick. I wanted to go back to sleep whenever I got up. I began to lose my appetite. Subsequently, I began to lose weight but my stomach became tighter and tighter, like an airtight balloon. The doctors found that my liver had doubled in size. They said that I didn’t have much more time and that I might die in nine months.



EN: What was your reaction?

Dr. Kim: I was completely shocked and my heart just dropped dead. All of my dreams were shattered and I asked the doctors if there was any other way or anything they could do to save me. The doctors said that no one could cure this. It was the most devastating news to my wife and my daughter and my son. Eventually I could hardly breathe or drink water, let alone eat food. My stomach was full like a nine-month pregnant woman but at the same time I lost 38 pounds. But you know, I couldn’t die like that—simply waiting for death. And so I really woke up. I went back to the Bible. I thought, “If God truly created the world and human beings, He must have the answer. He must know when I die and why I must die.”



EN: What did you do?

Dr. Kim: I went to Big Bear Mountain with the determination that I must get some answers from God. My wife and pastor drove me because I couldn’t drive. They dropped me off and left me with juice and water. And I began to read the Psalms. My heart began to move.



EN: Did you cry out to God?

Dr. Kim: On June 24, 1977, I went outside the cabin and I saw that a huge tree fell and I felt that somehow I needed to get to that stump. I was so weak but I held that stump and began to pray, “God, we came to America with $200 and three pieces of luggage. You allowed me to receive a Ph.D. If I die like this, how can this be glorified in Your name when people know that I’m a Christian?” Often we try to make God sympathize with our situation. In a way we’re trying to soften His heart so that He can pay attention to us. As soon as I finished this appeal to God, I uttered His words through my mouth. He gave me these words and I said, “Don’t you know you’re dying from toxins in your soul rather than toxins in your blood?” You see, the doctors said that I was going to go through excruciating pain—my body would be itchy and my stomach would be really tight and eventually the toxins in my body would take over my blood. How could I think that in the midst of that kind of situation? I was absolutely shocked and flabbergasted. God showed me that even though I may have looked fine on the outside, before my liver problem, my thoughts were poisonous. God began to convict me. I began to see my sins—every detail of my sins—that I committed against God, my wife, my friends, my children, my own lustful thoughts, pride—the thing that God most disliked was my pride, anger and bitterness. I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. It was as if I was watching my life from a TV screen. It was an incredible display of my life. Later on I wrote down every single sin and I filled 52 pages.



EN: Did you believe that He was going to cure you?

Dr. Kim: God is a God of order. Had God cured my liver first, I might’ve not been here right now. I might’ve gone my own way. He had to deal with the toxins in my soul—my thoughts. God really, really poured out His Spirit upon me. I couldn’t believe that I committed so much crime. He really embraced me, patted my back, saying, “I forgive you, I forgive you.” I know that I was completely forgiven. I knew that I was going to live—that I was going to be given another chance.



EN: After God revealed these things, what did you do?

Dr. Kim: I asked God for forgiveness. I never knew that I was that bad but God showed me sin after sin after sin—intellectually, spiritually and emotionally. God showed me the difference between confession and repentance. I wrote down all the things that I remembered and I did my best in dealing with my sins—including restitution. I knew that I had to deal with my sins in relation to people. I went to people that I bad-mouthed and thought bad things about—my family, my friends, my faculty, my peers, my students, my church members, my children, pastors, elders—all those people. I really asked for their forgiveness. Confession is one thing but repentance is restitution. God showed me a picture of a green grass. There were a lot of weeds growing together with the grass. Rather than uprooting all of these weeds, including the root, there was a lawnmower cutting everything together. When you cut it, you can hardly distinguish the weeds and the grass. But weeds grow fast and eventually kill the grass. It’s like cancer. God showed me that I committed so many sins but I never really confessed them. Yeah, I had been going to so many revivals and I had committed to a lot of things and I was involved with church but it never occurred to me to deal with my sins. It’s so sad because so many Christians today live like this. God is grieving because His children are not living upright and blameless—the way that He intends for them to live.



EN: How did you feel after you confessed all of these things?

Dr. Kim: In confessing all of these things, I found incredible freedom. I found the incredible love and grace of God. I was truly poured into.



EN: How did you live differently after this?

Dr. Kim: I began to live a transformed life. Before that experience, I was on the church choir. I was a Sunday School teacher in college. I was President of the Christian Club. I was appointed as a deacon. Many thought that I appeared to be a good Christian. You may fool and pretend to be a good Christian in the eyes of people but you can never fool God. He knows everything. While I had that encounter with God, I thought, “I have wasted 22 years of my life.” God asked, “What have you done for me?” I was crushed. I was broken into thousands of pieces. I realized that what you can do with these pieces is you can take all of these pieces and put them into an envelope and give them to the Potter. You must not only look good but you must also be valuable. You can be a totally different product. “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation, the old has gone, the new has come” (2 Corinthians 5:17). Some people had no idea what was going through my mind. After that, I was truly set free from the bondage of sin that had caught me for so many years. My life has been incredible. I still sin—fundamentally I’m a sinner, but now I’m so sensitive to sin so I know that I need to deal with it quickly.



EN: Did you continue to teach at Pepperdine?

Dr. Kim: I was teaching at Pepperdine again but in 1980 my family moved to Alaska.



EN: What prompted you to go to Alaska?

Dr. Kim: I had no reason to leave Pepperdine, it’s a wonderful university. My colleagues and our church members said that we were crazy. Not a single person confirmed that I should go to Alaska. But I had this urging in my heart. God really urged me to go to Alaska. I asked, “Why go to Alaska?” During that time I was reading Genesis. Somehow God was telling me to be the Joseph of Alaska. There is no prime minister in Alaska so I didn’t understand. I remembered my prayer at Big Bear Mountain when I said, “Please give me one more chance to live and I will do whatever you want me to do.”



EN: Were you excited to go?

Dr. Kim: I had to give up my teaching job at Pepperdine. My family was pretty well settled. We had a nice house with a swimming pool. I didn’t have any desire to go anywhere else. I thought, “I suffered and I just want to rest.” So at first I was reluctant but I knew I had to obey God. I told my wife, “Honey, Alaska is part of the U.S. They have Costco. So let’s go.” I had this urge. How could I say “no” to God. I thought, “I have to take a risk by trusting God.” My wife and children were crying but finally they agreed and we all moved to Alaska.



EN: Did you ever understand why God sent you to Alaska?

Dr. Kim: I learned why God sent me to Alaska. There were three major reasons. 1. Alaska has clean air, which I needed to recuperate my health. Alaska also has fresh seafood, which was also good for my health. 2. Alaska has a lot of snow and it reminded me of being washed by the blood of Jesus. When I saw Mount McKinley, I thought, “Whenever I see this grand nature that God created, such a majestic mountain covered with white snow, even through violent weather, once everything clears, God, please make me as pure as snow.” 3. All of the visions, God’s desire and God’s plan upon me would be shown to me while I was in Alaska. God’s revelation and His desire and plan were so evident to me. It was an incredible experience of the providence of God.



EN: What happened in Alaska?

Dr. Kim: We were encouraged to start a brand new church in Anchorage. A pastor came and I began to go out and evangelize. The church was growing wonderfully. A wonderful thing was going on so we were spiritually well fed. Family life was wonderful. Through my job the university was being blessed. Basically, God had given me to be Alaska’s Joseph. I was appointed to be a Special Advisor to Governors Steve Cowper (1986 - 1990) and Walter J. Hickel (1990 - 1994) on Economic Development and International Trade, and Northern Forum. Even though we were away from the mainland, everything was going well. I don’t think God likes His children to be comfortable. Being comforted is different from being comfortable.



EN: Did you feel that God was going to put you through something?

Dr. Kim: In January 1985, I was desperate to find God’s plan and His desire and His will in my life and for my life. It had been about eight years since God really promised me to fill my entire life internally and spiritually. As I told you, doctors completely had given up hope on me. Miraculously God had changed my heart, my mind, my soul. And He showed me physically what it meant to go from impossibility to possibility. So, everything was going well in Alaska. Again, in 1984, I was given the Chancellor’s Award for Excellence in Teaching at the University of Alaska Anchorage. But I was wondering, “God, why have you saved me? You sent your precious Son to die for my sins, to save me for eternal life.” I truly encountered God and asked Him to show me. I fasted for one week. I was almost like a lightning rod. I’m not sure if it was a voice or if it came from my heart but I believe it was God. “Making America greater with Korean-American Christians.” My immediate response was, “How can I make America greater? America is already great." There weren’t many 2nd generation Korean-Americans at that time. Mostly 1.5 generation. I thought, “I’m a small man in Alaska. You separated me from the mainland of America to make America greater?” I was very apprehensive. I thought that God was kidding with me. I was reminded by God that it was Him who was doing everything, not me. To make America great was going to be through God’s power, not my own power. During that time, God gave me an incredible challenge to take ownership of America. If we are children of God, we are princes and princesses. We need to take ownership of this country. And I’m not just talking about Korean-Americans. Everyone needs to take ownership of America.



EN: So, this is where the vision for JAMA (Jesus Awakening Movement for America/All Nations) came in?

Dr. Kim: Well, from 1985 I started to go to different parts of this country. I went around the country a lot in 1987. I met with different people—especially talking to young people. In 1995, I was given a huge burden to start Jesus Awakening Movement for America (JAMA) with my colleagues. Through prayer, we boldly started this without any money, without a real organization. My colleagues and I went on a retreat from October 28 -November 1, 1993 at Arrowhead Springs Christian Conference Center. After praying four nights, we were convinced that God wanted us to do this. We committed ourselves to each other and to God. Our verse at JAMA is 2 Chronicles 7:14: “Then if my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and heal their land.” I mean, seeking God’s face, I mean the holy, holy, holy glorious God’s face. There’s no more darkness. Everything is in the light. Everything is exposed. To pray and seek and seek and pray by faith and God said “Will I hear from heaven and forgive your sins and heal your land.” We need God to be the center of schools, communities, marketplaces, families, our lives, and our country. JAMA is not just for Koreans or Asians. It is for everyone. It’s not just for youth, kids or adults and professionals. It is for everyone. Looking back, I know that God was working. He was moving me to study. How do you start a Jesus Awakening Movement for America without knowing about America? God had already planned things. Nothing is by accident.



EN: Recently, you went through another physically trying time. What happened when you found out that you had cancer?

Dr. Kim: I hurt my back in 1980. I was lifting heavy stuff when we were preparing to move to Alaska. It was very painful. Before March 7, 2004, I had incredible back pain but I had no idea that I had cancer. I had an MRI and my doctor said to come to his office right away. I had a tumor that grew seven inches into my spine. My spinal chord was bent. While this tumor was growing, it was putting incredible pressure on my back. I learned that whenever God’s children suffer, it’s an opportunity for them to turn around and grow. God told me that it was an opportunity for me to turn suffering into triumphant victory. I didn’t know what that meant. At the same time God changed my prayer channel. Most of us pray for our needs. We change from our perspective. My prayer was reminding God of the promises that He made to me. There is hope because God has promises. Because of that there will be testimony.



EN: How did you fight the cancer?

Dr. Kim: I went through intensive chemotherapy and radiation therapy on my spine. They would look for spinal fluid. They punctured my spine five times. It was such excruciating pain. I was holding on, remembering Jesus’ suffering on the cross. It was incredible. I knew that I was going to be cured. After three times of chemotherapy, the cancer melted down. The doctors and nurses said that this was incredible. So, they wanted to clean up the remaining 10%. My wife went to the hospital numerous times. She was right by my side. My children came to visit me. Intercessory prayer—churches and friends were praying for me. I talked to the cancer, “Cancer, you’re small, you’re nobody. You’re smaller than me. Do you think you’re going to take over me? I’m going to kill you.” I had so much will power.



EN: What did you learn from the cancer?

Dr. Kim: I learned that God really wanted to spend time with me. I was traveling so much and I was working but I realized that God just really wanted to spend time with me. For the past 20 years I did a lot of things but God wanted a closer relationship with me so that I could know Him better. Nothing stopped me before. With cancer, I had to rest, I couldn’t go anywhere. I needed treatment. I had to reprioritize my life. And God really wanted to train me to trust Him. This trust business was incredibly precious. Hope + Faith = Trust, according to Brennan Manning. God was telling me that I needed to trust Him during cancer.



EN: Any future goals?

Dr. Kim: I have a burden to write several books on different topics in both Korean and English. I want to write about integrity in the workplace and on going through suffering only to come out stronger.



*This interview first appeared in Encounter Monthly Journal, April 2006



http://www.jamaglobal.com/wp/interview-with-dr-john-c-kim/